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Wednesday, April 6, 2011

Budget Cuts? Who cares!

@Mannwich:

Your 10:34 from yesterday: "I can't imagine these cuts, if they are passed, will be a stimulus to the economy..."

I got to thinking about this.

See http://jsmineset.com/2011/03/12/sp-500-versus-the-feds-balance-sheet/ which establishes a direct relationship between equity price and QE investment.

The Bernank has indicated that he feels the equities price rise will cause the economy to improve, and the government-supplied numbers are up, validating this.

I think this is inaccurate, and short-sighted. The numbers may be up, but the numbers have to go up a whole lot more to have any effect at all. And here’s why:

Let’s work this backwards. There’s about 313 Million people in the US, extrapolating the numbers from the US Census bureau. There’s about 2.59 persons/household, which makes about 121 million households. There are 43 million households receiving foodstamps. That’s about 1/3 of the household economy that doesn’t make enough money to afford food, and get out of poverty. That’s 1/3 of the household economy that can’t buy stuff to make the economy improve.

Let’s work the numbers backwards a little more. According to census.gov, there are about 37% of 313 million under 18 and over 65, probably at a very low employment rate, That leaves around 197 million employable. According to BLS, the number of working people in the US is 168.7 million. That means there are

197 – 168.7 = 28.3 million unemployed. At least.

The government (BLS) says there are 13.5 million unemployed. Somebody’s lying, by 100% (or 50%). Is it the Census bureau, or is it the BLS? I’ll tell you this, if somebody who worked for me was off by 100%, he’d have his hat in his hand in a hurry. But,

Lets go backwards a little further. Let’s assume that the over 65 and under 18 are uniformly distributed over the number of households. That means 116 Million over 121 million households, or about 1 person per household, more or less. That leaves about 1.5 people/household, of which 28.3 million are unemployed. That would mean:

28.3 / 1.5 = 19 million households unemployed
43 – 19 = 24 million households underemployed, assuming the balance of the 43 million foodstamp recipient households are in the underemployed category.

Assuming it takes around 70000 per year to run a household, and assuming the underemployed are at a 50% of the amount necessary to run a household, that means we’re short around 2.1T of GDP.

So this year, assuming a 2% GDP growth, our shortfall is
2.1T – ( .02 * 2.1T) = 1.8T

We the people have to come up with an extra 1.8T in taxes. Not too bad, right? I think US tax revenue is around 2.1T. So just about doubling our tax should cover it. Not gonna happen, you say?

Next year, we have to add that 1.8T shortfall into the equation, because we have to borrow it, we don’t have the GDP to pay for it. So the next year, the equation looks like:

This years shortfall – GDP growth + last year’s shortfall + last years shortfall * interest rate
Or (assuming a 3% bond interest rate, and keeping the same 2% GDP growth rate,)

2.1T – (14.72T * .02) + 1.8T + (.03 * 1.8T) =
2.1T - .2944 + 1.8 + .054T = 3.659T

The following year, this number is
2.1T- ((14.72 + .2944) * .02) +3,659T + (.03 * 3.659T) = 5.56T

So I programmed this into an excel spreadsheet. In 8 years, the debt load is greater than GDP. In 40 years, we have a debt load of 132 Trillion, only about 4* GDP. We don’t pay it off in 100 years.

There is no out for us. We simply have to kill 43 million households.

71 comments:

  1. @Rock,

    Bernanke = Greenspan. And now there are trying to spread the debt disease to Ems. Live life to the fullest and then default - is the name of the game.


    ICan

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  2. CAD/USD = 1.0430.

    o.k U$D is reserve currency!


    ICan

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  3. @Rock,

    "There is no (way) out for us". At the moment, forex has come to the same conclusion.


    ICan

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  4. @ICan:

    Your 9:21:

    That is one legacy I'm ashamed of leaving for my children.

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  5. Great post, Rock. I can't imagine those 43MM households will be all that pleased about sacrificing TWICE for bankers and their elite friends, but maybe I'm wrong about that. Maybe they'll continue to take it quietly and for the most part wrongly blame themselves, and slink off in shame never to be heard from again? Who knows though? We could ultimately be surprised.

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  6. From Macro-man blog:

    China and metals demand,

    "Anecdotal stories of gold demand and 10 ton order in silver are maiking us think we don't want to step in front of this one..It appears everyone is selling appartments to buy mentals".

    This is scarry - looks like a repeat of 2008.

    Yet there is $200 billion in POMO left in that $600B announced by the FED in Aug last year.

    ICan

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  7. That's been my premise, I Can. Very 2008-ish. A lot of crises seem to be kind of lurking but the market is ignoring them for the time being, like 2008. It can't ignore them forever.

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  8. Maybe the CAD should become the world's new reserve currency? LOL.

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  9. VXX continues it's drift downward into the wilderness.

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  10. Rock - awesome post my friend! You're a hard act to follow.

    More whe I get to work.

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  11. @Rock,

    SU is not following oil?

    I still have some to sell.

    ICan

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  12. Morning everyone. Stumbling around to find my desk. Plus my data feed will not update the missing days. Grrr!.

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  13. Nice post, Rock.

    I see since I was gone that the market decided to test the February highs. Very interesting. By tomorrow I will have done some analysis to see how everything stands.

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  14. An answer to my 10:38

    "Alberta plan should be 'minor' hit to oil sands firms : analyst". theglobeandmail.com/globeinvestor.

    Tuesday, the Alberta govt announced a new enviornmental plan for oil sands - so the sell-off was just knee jerk reaction.

    ICan

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  15. Two funny addendum to our real estate search.

    A house we looked at was bank owned and next to another vacant property being sold as a lot, so we decided to take a peek, was originally listed at $3m in 2009. It was now listed at $1.89 and it held a mortgage of about that amount.

    When we arrived, the listing agent was there, which is unusual these days, and he told us that the bank will take $1.5 as the bank is in trouble, too. We were never interested in this house but we were shocked to say the least.

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  16. The second surprise was that we were walking after dinner and came upon a mixed use condo/retail building. A corporate apartment was on the market as the corporation didn't need it anymore and wanted to get it off it's books. They paid $1.7 in 2007. New listing price $899K, but they will accept $700k. It was a nice apartment, 3 bed, 3 bath, balcony, the best finishes and appliances. We decided that we had no interest in buying a condo, but were stunned at the price reduction and the need to try and make a deal with any lookers with a pulse. There are lots of over priced condos there as a result of the boom.

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  17. It seems like Boulder's real estate market, despite claims that it was holding up, was over built, and had excessive speculation at the high end, just like everywhere else. And people are just now either being forced to sell by their banks, or the banks are marking down these foreclosed properties.

    Those expensive properties are out of my price range but we did see plenty homes that were 30% or so overpriced that were in our price range that had been sitting and sitting. And any interest we did show resulted in pleas to make an offer, any offer.

    Reading the stats on Boulder would lead you to believe that they did not take much of a beating during the down turn, but I think that is manipulation of the numbers judging what I saw.

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  18. @ICan
    I see a bunch of oils are off the last couple of days. They may be consolidating, or getting ready to face what the talking heads are saying, that oil at this price will slow the global recovery.

    I hear Thor's driving less. That should slow the economy by itself.

    I got out of my XOM today, I wasn't happy with it's performance over the last couple of weeks. I could have done better.

    I'm thinking to nibble a little VXX. Could see some action tomorrow if European interest rates rise.

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  19. They've got a camera in a pill now. There was just an ad on Bloomberg.

    Maybe my colonoscopies will be a little more pleasant now.

    Hmmmm I wonder if they reuse them........

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  20. Rock - oh yes, I'm sure they re-use them. I'd imagine the camera itself is in a disposable capsule. I could go on with about a hundred different jokes about that, but I'm sure you're mind is about as twisted as mine so I'll leave it to your own imagination ;-)

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  21. As for driving less. . . . today was supposed to be my dry run, I didn't remember that until I was already at work.

    I am not a morning person.

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  22. Rock – Great post and although I understand far less about life and the world then I do understand, the reasoning you laid out in your above argument aligns closely with why, I do not trust this market. Oh I do believe it will go up some more, but there is nothing to keep it up, how long it takes is any bodies guess, heck maybe if it is kept inflated long enuff if will get backfilled and everything turns out peachy.

    And even though I believe your basic premise, I think it is important to try and poke holes in any well laid argument. And so far there is little I can come up with, so I ask anyone else (Including Rock) to try and come up with more ways to poke holes in his assertion, that we are digging ourselves into a debt hole that we will (Are)be unable to recover from.

    The first thing is the U.S. population of 313 million; illegal’s are not counted in the Census Bureau and the ones I know go to great lengths to avoid being counted. So it is really any bodies guess how many are out there, but what is true is they normally take the lower paying and/or part time and seasonal jobs that “Americans” do not want to take. They need an SSI number to work, so are paying taxes into the system, but because their SSI number is fraudulent are unable to collect (SS, not the taxes, they can and do collect on those). Also I know for a fact the state of Washington is currently turning away welfare recipients who can not prove citizenship. And that the green card filling fees have gone from $180 to over $450

    If enuff pressure is put on illegals, they will eventually leave, which will create a hole in lower paying jobs that will need to be filled, reduce the number of welfare recipients’ and leave unclaimed money in our SS system.

    Again I have no clue as to the number of illegal’s nor the number who would vacate their stake in the American Dream, but let is say it is 3 million.

    So that brings Rocks number of 43 million to 40 million and proof that a strong recovery is…..A strong recovery is….

    There Rock, I poked a hole and got rid of 3 million people for ya – We are safe now.

    Mangy Mutt

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  23. Thor - Just so you know I am laughing at you buddy :)

    First day of telecomuting and you show up at work.

    Classic my friend :)

    Maybe you can just stay at work and telecommute being at home.

    Mutt

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  24. Makes a lot of sense, Denise. I'm hearing similar things are happening in Minneapolis. Deny reality, obfuscate, fudge, extend and pretend. It will likely only serve to drag out this housing mess in the end though. No matter. The bubble is back in equities and commodities. Flipping and flopping one bubble for another. It's all good.

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  25. @Mutt:
    12:28: Brilliant comment!

    12:26:
    There is a typo, where it says
    2.1T – ( .02 * 2.1T) = 1.8T
    it should say
    2.1T - (.02 * 14.7T) = 1.8T.

    GS woulda fired me for that one.

    But the illegals with fake SS#s make the problem worse, because they are counted as working, but don't add to the headcount. The actual unemployment percentage of the 313Million would then be higher. I think the number is pretty small, personally, because all the illegals I knew in Redwood City didn't have SS numbers. And, as you point out, to make a difference in the overall evaluation, there would have to be millions and millions of them served, like McDonalds.

    Do the illegals you know with SS #s take unemployment? Just curious.

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  26. Technicals - Su chart on Finviz.com. H&S or a larger W?



    ICan

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  27. Rock - ok, had enough free time to read through your post, man that math took me forever to get through, not my strong point. Very depressing, agree that we're not being told the whole story here. Not so much that they're outright lying to us, more like the numbers the BLS puts out are massaged and that the data tracked for inflation is tracked in such a way as to minimize the reporting of it.

    I think Denise was the one who suggested that what they're doing is taking us on a long, slow, managed, decline.

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  28. Mutt - Don't joke about that! :-) Seriously though, my god, even my company, which I really enjoy working for, really blurs the line between work and home, with blackberries, laptops, iphones, etc, they want us in contact at all times. I'm used to that working in IT, but seeing it filter down to all the other employees is pretty sad. I'd like to not be getting emails from people at 4:30 on a Sunday or 9:30 Tuesday night, but what can you do?

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  29. Taking UnemployementApril 6, 2011 at 1:14 PM

    Rock - Yes, most of the illegals I know, would take unemployement.

    Most of the time it was paid into the system while they were working, so they were basically getting their own money back.

    Rabbit Trail: Employers are required to pay unemployment on employees, if the employee is laid of for certain reasons, they have a little to fall back on while looking for another job. But if the employee is not laid off, the state keeps the money, therefore it is a tax. - End Trail.

    But if I understand the tax code changes, people who are recieve unemployement benifits for 2011 will have to declare and pay taxes on it. This will hurt a whole lot of people, as it will come as a nasty surprise for many.

    Mutt

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  30. @Mutt:
    I thought unemployment was taxable even before. What do I know?

    @ICan:
    of the 55 stocks I follow in the oil sector (big oils, operations, equipment), 25 of them have rolled over and fallen out of their up-channel. About 15 of the 30 that haven't only need another day to fall out.

    If this is the start of a downtrend for the overall sector, IMHO there is no reason for it. Profits will be immense in earnings season.

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  31. Rock - I will have to check with the Smart One (that would be my wife) before I commit 100% one way or another, but it is my understanding that un-employement was set up to pay at 70% of previous working pay (With a few stipulations) and because it it not earned income, it is not taxed.

    Let me check and I will get back to you.

    Mutt

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  32. Rock - You are correct, unemployement has always been taxed - except last year there was a credit given, so many people did not have to pay.

    The credit was only a 1 time deal and only for last year. All previous years unemployement was taxable.

    Sorry for any confusion.

    Mutt

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  33. @Mutt:

    I have to pay tax on unearned income. Called Dividends and Interest, and Cap Gains.

    There is one hole that I can think of in the analysis above. Some of the under 18 and over 65 are taking Social Security. This would reduce the 70000 and 35000 by as much as 17400 per year, but if you play the averages, it's only .27 Trillion for the 43 million food stamp households. SS pays 729 billion, so The 1.8T becomes only 1.53T. Not enough, yet.

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  34. Former leader AAPL has been lagging badly during this last push up.

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  35. @Mutt
    One thing that will help too is if they took SS away from those that don't need it.

    And remove the dependent loophole for medicaid and medicare payments to the elderly. There's this deal that if you come from China, and your parents give you all their money and assets so they are indigent, and you work and pay taxes, you can declare your parents to be your dependents, and they become eligible for medicare and medicaid.

    Lots of Asians do that, because of the strong loyalty children feel for their parents.

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  36. Anyone taking bets on whether or not we're going to get a shut down?

    Denise - I forgot to say Welcome Back! We missed you!!

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  37. I commented before that a risk/reward ratio is pretty good once the VXX returns to it's historical low.

    Today, it's down to 26.36, and it's historical low is 27.71.

    Not of course that it can't fall below 27.71, but when the announcement of an interest rate hike in Europe and all the fallout from that happens, I suspect there will be a pop.

    If you want to play the risk, buy VXX. If you want to play the pop, put in a market order (if your broker will let you do that). Today it got up to 28.68, so if there's a pop at the open, you'll be in at the open price if you set a market order at maybe 28.71

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  38. Yeah, Dss, welcome back. I missed you a lot.

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  39. My 2:20, make that VXX is currently at 28.36. Historical low is 27.71.

    With my eyes, 8's and 6's look a lot alike, especially at this time of day. Night.

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  40. @Rock,

    Who is fossil fuel king of the world?

    Russia, Brazil? Saudi? Canada?

    ICan

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  41. I say no shutdown, Thor. They'll do a last minue deal and Obama will mostly cave just for the sake of saying he "got something done"....yet again.

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  42. On another totally different note, there's nothing quite like a nice, fresh, crispy baguette eaten as a sandwich. Combine that with tropical temps of 59 degrees and sunny, and I'm one happy Mannwich right now. Long bike ride coming later too! Training for a 100 mile ride mostly on gravel and lots of hills in Southern MN in middle of May. Went out Saturday for first ride of the year and was sucking big-time wind on just a 30 miler, so I have lots of work to do.

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  43. Fossil fuel superpower is the U.S.

    "A fossil fuel king of the world".

    "A non partisan U.S. agency calculated the proved reserves of oil, natural gas, and coal in America are far ahead of any nation on the Planet.


    http://www.theglobeandmail.com/report-on-business/commentary/neil-reynolds/

    I thought I cheer you up after my snarky remark on U$D earlier this morning.

    ICan

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  44. TLT getting smacked around today.

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  45. @Jeff,

    Please keep us updated on you 100 mile training.


    ICan

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  46. @Jeff,


    Your SLV should be doing really good.


    ICan

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  47. @ICAn

    I would have guessed the Russkies. Ehey export a lot of coal.

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  48. Will do, I Can. Indeed it is doing quite well. Have a small nibble of GDX doing well too. Dumped my DIG for a quick profit. Wish I had held it.

    Will be sure to keep you posted on the training! Am excited to get out and ride today. Feels like a heat wave at nearly 60. How sad is that? LOL.

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  49. @ICan
    Sorry I misunderstoopid. I thought you meant "producer".

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  50. @Rock,

    I rather your nation is #1 then the Russies - gang of thugs. ETF -Russia has been a laggard because of that. But they are very similar to Canada in resources.

    ICan

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  51. @Dss:

    AAPL's on the road to recovery.

    They have an app you can buy so you can surf ads and rate them.

    First time anyone paid to see an ad. Only Steve Jobs could make you believe you should pay to see ads.

    We're gonna miss that guy.

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  52. Corey - at the blog 'afraidtotrade' - Keep volume indicator in prespective.


    ICan

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  53. In line with Rock's post?

    http://www.zerohedge.com/article/us-materially-expand-food-stamp-program-america-prepares-surge-poverty-effect

    I'm also in the slow slide camp. TPTB are trying to make the slow slide as super slo mo as possible hoping that many of us don't even notice how poor we are until it's way too late.

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  54. In the new bizarro world, up is down and down is up.

    Americans Begin Paying Credit Cards First, Mortgages Second [CHART]

    http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2011/04/06/americans-credit-cards-mortgages_n_842756.html

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  55. From marketwatch.com,

    "Rates to rise in 2012?". QE2 ends in June, but rates will rise in 2012. But who will buy debt at zirp?

    "Portugal FM says country will need bailout from EU:report". Six months ago they said they don't need bailout? Ha! Only a year ago they said no bailout needed?

    And the bank shares are rallying even pigs like NBG - up over 5% today.


    ICan

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  56. @Jeff(3:04)

    Thought out strategy! Who needs their homes?


    ICan

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  57. Manny - wow, I didn't know you were so physically fit! You do always mention that you're going to the gym though. Still, a 100 mile bike ride? That's pretty much like driving from LA all the way to Palm Springs (105 miles). Brutal.

    You're going to have to eventually move to a place with hills and mountains!

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  58. Exactly, I Can. Better to keep the credit spigot open so that peeps can eat, buy shit they truly need (and don't need), as well as pay off old credit cards with new ones......

    @Thor: Not THAT physically fit but am slowly making some nice inroads. Much of the motivation is in protest of our crappy health "care" system that I'd rather not have to rely on, and the other part is simply feeling better overall. CO is in my mid to longer term sights, so hills it will be!

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  59. @Thor: And it's no guarantee I'll finish that 100 miler, but hopefully if I just go at my own REALLY slow pace, I'll eventually get there. Of course, everyone may have already packed up and gone home by then. LOL.

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  60. I'm on my own fitness goal for this year. I turn the big four-oh in November and my plan is to be the most physically fit I've ever been. So far off to a good start. Plus, with the medical industry in the state it's in right now, it's probably a good idea for people our age to stay as healthy as we can for as long as we can to avoid getting sucked into the shredder we call Healthcare in this country.

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  61. Thanks for the welcome back. I missed not being here, too. Daily routine and all that.

    Later today I will have some time to do some analysis.

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  62. I turned last year, Thor, and had similar goals of getting into the best shape (and health) of my life. My advice to you - be motivated and aggressive but still be patient. I decided that I still have to enjoy the things I like to do, which includes good food and drink from time to time. No sense in making yourself miserable while trying to get "fit" or be "healthy". Part of being "healthy" is indulging once in a while, I think.

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  63. Thanks Rock. I see you've hijacked your own trading lesson thread by posting twice today. :p

    re ECB rates:I believe a 0.25% increase is expected, and therefore already priced in the markets.

    What could shake them maybe is the opposite: if ECB doesn't confirm this interest rate hike. Now THAT would be a surprise.

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  64. And welcome back Denise. Will read your market analysis with great interest;)

    Talking about analysis, I've not seen I-Man popping up recently ? Would be useful if he may share some update too.

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  65. Meanwhile QKwadafie is asking for a cease-fire. He's offering talks to set up elections.

    Don't think the dirty animal has been enlightened overnight, and wants no more deaths. My guess is he feels he can't last much longer.

    Good luck to the rebels, and Western pilots. That seems like a rightful fight.

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  66. Manny - oh yes, totally agree. I've been in great shape most of my adult life, never overweight, have gone to the gym regularly for almost 20 years now. I'm not the same weight I was in high school (45 pounds more muscle) but I do still wear the same pant size!

    Luckily I have work to help, we have two gyms here at work, and we're given an hour (in addition to lunch) to work out if we want to. Diet is always my hardest though, I love to eat, and I'm always wanting carbs. I cut the fast food out (except as a treat) about a year ago, trying to add in green things is such a challenge!

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  67. edit my comment 5:05PM : after some digging, not sure Quad Daffy (©Rock) made any statement about elections. Just promises for more democracy and such.

    Doesn't change the fact that he has his back to the wall.

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  68. Wolfie - agreed, I just hope we don't end up turning Libya into another Iraq.

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  69. Mannwich - Don't know if you are still around, just wanted to let you know we got hail dumped on us about 1/4 and it is sticking.

    Weird weird weather.

    Mutt

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  70. Wow mutt! Crazy weather. Just logged 46 miles in the saddle and am totally wiped. What a struggle. I really got to get out more if I hope to have any chance of finishing the 100 Miler and not hurting myself.

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  71. Manny that's great! I envy that drive!

    Mutt, your crazy weather is headed our way. The snow level is coming down to 2,000 feet. We've had snow on the mountains here all winter, people save they've never seen that. Drive home from work at night is breathtaking sometimes. With downtown ahead of you, and snow capped mountains right behind them, all aglow in a glorious LA smog-set! :-)

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