I think this topic may be timely now.
We may wish to look for tops in either stocks, sectors or markets after our little pullback, and before we break through our previous top. I know Mannwich has said the top is in, but Farley says we often get inversion points revisited and tested. Right now, with the Fed still buying, we may go up for awhile. Let’s see if we can use Farley’s top definition.
Farley is a little inconsistent in his definitions of topping. He says that a top is a single event, and conversely, a bottom is a process. As we all know, Dss says that a top is a process, and the top may not be clarified for some months after the event.
I believe Dss.
Here is a pattern which Farley identifies as a Double Top (which clearly shows it s a process, so maybe Farley’s editor missed the section or he didn’t have one)
Things to know about this pattern not on the chart are:
1. The SPY was retreating, the 3LB was in a clear downtrend.
2. The average volume for TEX was 2.2Million, and on the two days that were down throwing it out of the up channel were about 1.2 million. Very light volume, almost 50% of the average. That means there may be no commitment to the price action.
Commenting on the chart:
The tops are almost exactly at the same price point.
The Stochastics are overbought with a clear trough in between the tops.
A W pattern was not formed, because the stochs never returned to the overbought conditionl This reinforces this pattern is likely to be an "M"
The relative strength is falling. That is, this stock is weaker than the market.
There is likely a strong support point at around 32.40.
It’s hard to tell from the screen capture, but the stochs’s %K and %D have crossed over.
IMHO, this is a classic double-top.
To test this we should establish a position with a stop-loss.
We establish the position just as it falls out of it's up-channel, and confirms a downward price direction. Now we follow it. As it moves in our direction, we may add to the short position. And we may move our stop higher. We would do this because as the stock establishes a down-channel, we aren’t sure where the top of the channel is. What I do is reduce my position if the stock moves against me, and add when it moves in my direction until it gets beyond my stop limit, then I just move to a trailing stop. Let's see what happened:
TEX has established a clear down-channel. The stochs have turned over and are headed south. Relative strength has fallen. Now we have to be careful to make sure TEX doesn't violate the down-channel, so we might set our stop at 37.41, above the channel. Or, we might take some shares off as it moves upward in the channel, adding when it turns around.
No comments?
ReplyDeleteOK, can anyone identify the error made when the position was established? What was wrong?
(this is a test. Not a final exam, you do that on your own money).
@Rock,
ReplyDeleteThnak you for the post.
Q1 and bonuses - Cann't keep this market down.
Read somewhere yesterday - OPEC set for $1000bn in export revenues. Record if oil stays above $100/barrel. I think it was ft.com
SU chart - cup and a handle? Bullish?
ICan
Thanks Rock. No time to go through your analysis right now, but looks appetizing.
ReplyDeleteMeanwhile, things are getting dire here on my side of the trade. I look for 1333 to provide some resistance, then last chance at the previous high 1345. Whatever moves come next, I'd probably better step back for a few days and return to the drawing board anyway.
My virtual portfolio is getting killed this week. More due to bad risk management (9+% loss on one trade) than bad choices in the positions, the latter being part of the game.
Later.
Last bubble the easy money was put primarily into homes. Before that it was stocks. Back to stocks (and commodities) again in this game of alternating bubbles.
ReplyDeleteHas my top call been breached? Off to airport heading back to reality and can't easily check. No fear.
ReplyDeleteFrom Cobras blog -http://bbs.cobrasmarketview.com/
ReplyDeleteRetailers are still very bullish. Rydex Beta Chase Index chart.
Institutions were in distribution mode, now neutral?
ICan
Morning all! Excellent post as usual Rock!
ReplyDelete200K new jobs, not too shabby.
NPR has had a special every morning this week on oil imports from Canada. Good series!
ReplyDelete@Rock,
ReplyDelete$TRAN and SPX charts. Feb 18 high. W.
ICan
Well the correction may be over for now, but one think that looks like it's going to stick around for the long haul is oil over $100.
ReplyDeleteManny if you're around today, it cost me $67 bucks to fill up this morning :-(
Rock - I have read and re-read you post, great job and very informative.
ReplyDeleteI have looked for "What was wrong" when the position was established and the only thing I can think of (And it may just be me) but the stop loss was set a little higher then I would have.
Mutt
Thor - $70 to fill up YIKES!!!
ReplyDeleteI have a 74 Charger, with a 440, this car is set to be my daily driver soon. I am not looking forward to filling that thing up on a regular basis.
Mutt
Mutt - how far do you have to commute to work? I'm jealous of your car! I almost bought the new one!
ReplyDelete@Mutt
ReplyDeleteThe stop-loss was picked in the event that TEX would test the high again. If the price went above the stop-loss value, the price pattern would have turned to a "w" where the right side was higher than the left, a bullish pattern and time to exit a short.
What was wrong, was the position was established before the 15 minute stochastics hit the overbought condition. Because of stock buying pressure, the stochs might have hit 80% and the price would have risen, making the entry price point lower than it should have been. Luckily, the price pressure was small, the volume was small (see the volume bars before 15:15?) and the price didn't rise much.
Do you see the volume bars at 15:15? That's the correct point to enter a short, the stochs were approaching 80%, the relative strength was falling, and the price was beginning to turn down.
When you see big volume bars like these during the trading day, you can look to see if you see a setup, because you will usually find one. There are people out there who trade these setups, and they all see the same thing at essentially the same time.
@Mutt:
ReplyDeleteThe one thing we can't tell is where the orders are, and their volumes. For example, we don't know if the volume at 15:15 was because of capitulation order replacement (where current orders are replaced with orders at a lower price point) or by new orders entering, for example someone selling short.
The difference between the two affects the probability of the future stock price direction. The price is more likely to fall if the orders are capitulation orders than new short-sale orders.
The exchanges have this data, and HFTs connecting directly to the data feeds from the exchanges can get this data and make trades based on the results. We cannot see this data.
All we can do is guess. In this case, my guess was that these were new entry, short-sale orders. Why? (consider the other 3 factors of the market, not technical) 1) the volume is light; TEX volume was 50% of normal. That is not much fear in evidence, no pressure to capitulate. 2) TEX is a company that will make equipment ordered by Japanese to rebuild. 3) Like CAT, TEX's fundamentals are strong; the company sells to other companies, not to end users. (Other than technical which the charts tell us, the market consists of fundamentals, psychologicals, and structurals, all equally important).
@Mutt:
ReplyDeleteI'm not saying that TEX was a good trade. In fact, it was a risky trade because there was no volume commitment. That's why anyone following this should set their stops close to the downchannel so they get out if somebody with deep pockets decides to buy. That will cause a short squeeze and a pop in the price.
The reason I chose TEX was because of the pattern, and how closely it fit with Farley's double-top pattern. Next pattern is Adam and Eve. I like that one.
Also, in the future, I will put up a post on volume, and order placement. I pretty much understand enough to write on it, but I wanna have one more lunch with "too much Indian", as ICan would say, with my mathematician friend. Also I'm looking into a tool which may become available to us to monitor certain order placement.
All future Anonymouse Trading features. Stay Tuned!
@Mutt:
ReplyDeleteI gave away my 1970 Mustang Mach 1 428 CobraJet to a friend who collects muscle cars when I came here to Singapore. It was my daily driver. He told me that when I come back, he'll give me a 1965 SS396 Corvette.
I hope your R/T has the progressive linkage 3 duce setup, if not, you'll get about a 33% improvement in mileage coupled with a 20% improvement in top-end torque if you drop one in. As I recall, the 440 six-pack was faster on the strip, but the hemi was faster on the track because of the weight.
I am jealous. My daily driver right now is a 460HP turbocharged diesel that I pay $0.71 to ride 4 stops and get off. Along with 40-60 other Singaporeans.
Thor- Fortunatly I only commute 5 miles each way, but it is in town driving and I spend more time at stop lights then actually driving.
ReplyDeleteI got the car for my oldest boy's 15th birthday, with the thought process that we would work on it together (Big joke there) and that we would sell the car and work on another one.
I wanted him to learn a car is NOT a good investment, but that as long as he does not become emotionally attached to his cars and he puts the effort into it he can have a nice ride, while fixing and selling them.
At any rate, the car is about 90-95% done, he is now going on 20 and has up in about 2% of the work, but thinks I should just hand him the keys.
Because I waited for him to want to help with the car, it has taken far longer then it should have and my original thought process has been thrown out the window.
Oh well that is the way life goes sometimes, but it is a fun car to drive.
Mutt
@ICan:
ReplyDeleteYes, we have a W formation in the SPX.
The time to invest is when the weekly, daily, and hourly stochastics of the SPX are at the 20% level. That's the time in your career that you will make the most money.
We hit that, the week of 3/13, the day of 3/16, and the hour of 13:30.
That's when you want to buy the strongest stock. That's when you'll make the most money. Then, you can go play golf, and wait until the stochs are at 80%, then sell.
Rock - Thanks for your great input on TEX and how you are seeing things.
ReplyDeleteI FINALLY have a fairly good handle on placing stops, of course it took loosing money to get the grasp of it, but like you have said several times, there is no reason to loose money and there is always another opportunity around the corner and well placed stops help both of those.
The next thing I am concentrating on learning is volume, so I appreciate your above explanation and very much look forward to your post on volume and order placement.
"Too much Indian" - Growing up on an Indian Reservation, the meaning that you and I-can are using is a little different then mine.
Mutt
@Mutt:
ReplyDeleteNo offense, but I think you may have mis-spoke. I think you may have meant to say you grew up on a Native American reservation.
As I recall, we made reservations only for Native Americans and Japanese (in 1940). I think all the Indians moved to Canada, eh?
Rock - He's talking about Native Americans :-)
ReplyDeleteRock - No offense taken on my part.
ReplyDeleteThe BIA (Bureau of Indian Affairs), says they are Indians. There is also the Indian Agency and Indian Housing. Of course these are all goberment agencies so they don’t matter.
But most importantly the Tribe refers to it’s self as an Indian Tribe and the folks who own the land and belong to the Tribe call themselves Indian. The people I know, went to school and grew up with who are Native call themselves Indians.
A couple three weeks ago, I was fortunate enough to go to a Pow Wow, the people running it referred to it as an Indian Pow Wow.
I am not the most politically correct person out there but am more then willing to call people by the title they like, not that which is imposed upon them. And from my experience the Indians I have come into contact with would prefer to be called Tribal Members or Indians. Of course this point of view only reflects a small view and does not encompass all Indians, Tribes or Native Americans every where, so maybe the vast majority would prefer to be called Native Americans. But until they change the name of their own land from Indian to Native American or Tribal, I will stick with Indian.
But then I could not a referenced “Too much Indian” as having a different meaning and saying “Too much Tribal” would not have made any sense at all.
Back when I was a young’un, I use to work at a pharmacy and we took AT&T phone payments there. One day a lady came in to make her payment, but she forgot her receipt so I started to write one up for her. “What is the phone number” – She gave me the phone number, “What is the address” She gave me the address” “What is the name the phone is under” – She says “Whitekiller”. Oh CRAP! That was her and her husbands last name.
We also developed film there and one day a guy comes in says he wants to pick up his film. “What’s your name” He tells me his first name. “Ok what’s your last name” He repeats his first name again and says “Every one talks about” – “Cool so your name is xxxx and every one talks about you, but I still need to know your last name, so I can find the film” It turns out his last name is Everyonetalksabout.
Mutt
My first internet handle was Rez Dawg.
ReplyDeleteRez dogs can be found through out the reservation, they have no owner and are some of the homeliest dogs on the planet, the can be pretty mean too, cuz if they did not learn to fight at a young age they died.
But rez dog also referrers to non-Tribal Members who lived on the reservation.
So when I moved off, I switched to Mangy Mutt.
Still a homely dog that doesn't quite belong, but a little higher up then a rez dawg :)
Mutt
Mutt - hah, isn't that funny? How the names of entire people have to be changed because of political corrected. I have the same issues in my own "group". The names constantly change. LGBT I thought was the worst. I have nothing in common with a transgendered person and although I personally have no issues with transgendered people, I don't necessarily want to be lumped together with them. Now, we're apparently not supposed to use the "gay" label because it's too make centric and doesn't include lesbians.
ReplyDeleteAlways hated that about SF - the militant political correctness
Mutt - hah, now we know where your handle comes from! How ironic that dogs played a roll in both our handles!
ReplyDeleteThor - I agree with you, transgender people are not gay nor lesbian, they are people (In most cases) who honestly believe they were (And some times are) born in the wrong body - This does not make them gay nor lesbian.
ReplyDeleteMy wife is Mexican, yet it is politally correct to call her hispanic or latino. She is neither and perfers to be called Mexican.
Yet you get within the Mexican culture, there are sub-sets of what they perfer to be called.
I honestly have no problem calling people by the title they believe they should be called (No I will NOT start calling you Thor The Magnificent)but some times it gets confusing to get that right.
So unless it is offensive or I am corrected, I will stick with what I know.
Mutt
Mutt - I can understand the hispanic/latino thing. Agree, Mexicans always want to be called Mexicans because that's what they are, they have a very strong, very proud culture. I think Hispanic and Latino come into play, at least here in LA, because the Salvadorians or the Guatemalan's don't want to be lumped in with the Mexicans. . . . or so I'm told.
ReplyDeleteAnd you can call me anything you want, I'm not easily offended. . . .although sometimes my feelings are easily hurt in case you hadn't already noticed ;-)
Rock said:
ReplyDeleteThe time to invest is when the weekly, daily, and hourly stochastics of the SPX are at the 20% level.
That's when you want to buy the strongest stock...and wait until the stochs are at 80%, then sell.
Very good point Rock.
Dan
Dow at a six week high. How fast was that over?
ReplyDelete